AntiBVBL

Well, at least he said “after arrest.” Looks like he finally figured out what happened on April 29th! A good sign, no?

YES, yes, everything else he said was an embarrassment to the county, but there always is a bright side. You could even see this as progress.

Why is he the go-to guy for a sign that isn’t even in his jurisdiction?

Good question, Casual Observer. It seems to me that a City of Manassas official would be the better person to address City of Manassas issues. I guess Corey couldn’t give up his 3 minutes of national fame for the month.

FAIR and Stewart probably contacted FOX saying “We want to get our crime misinformation out.” FOX said, “Okay, but it’s not really a news story in and of itself. What else do you have?” And FAIR/Stewart said, “We have this sign in Manassas.”

If Mr. Fernandez were not Hispanic, spoke without an accent, and could as easily dismantle Corey Stewart’s hapless misinformation campaign as, say, most of the contributors to this blog could, I wonder if FOX “News” would be so eager to have him on the show.

It’ll be interesting to see if Mr. Fernandez manages to retain his freedom of speech… in the land of the free.

My God, you folks actually support this guys actions! Talk about far left (and South). I only wish that there were more billboards, only from the other point of view, so that this whole holier than thou issue of ‘free speech’ versus common sense would come to a conclusion. If there was only one equivalent billboard from the other it would make for great entertainment. I like the comment about Corey speaking of matters not in PWC when half the people on this blog don’t live in Manassas either, and yet have definite opinions on that ‘wonderful’ billboard. Fernandez is a blight on the community, and makes a great poster child for the anti-community behavior that is brought by many illegals.

Think the consensus here is that neither Stewart nor Fernandez represent the area well. They sound the same.

Juturna,

I agree, but at least Corey isn’t breaking any written rules or laws in his actions. Fernandez on the other hand, geesh!

SA – myriad of ethical laws Cory has violated in my humble opinion. They have a different standard than those laws which I agree Mr F has violated.
Corey is charged with public trust which I believe he has simply ignored, discarded or fails to understand.

Ah Juturna, it depends on what you mean by ‘public’. In this country that usually refers to US citizens who support and defend the country.

Corey is a liar and an embar-ASS-ment to this county. His misallocation of our tax dollars is grounds enough for investigation, never mind his policy taken from FAIR. LOSER LOSER LOSER.

The owners of 9500 Liberty Street have been issued another zoning violation.

According to a letter from the city of Manassas dated July 11, Gaudencio Fernandez and Delia Alvarez violated a zoning ordinance that doesn’t allow a semi-public use on private property without a special use permit.

On July 7 and 8, the property was used by marchers in the People’s Walk—an event designed to raise environmental and Native American concerns in the United States.

According to the letter, cars were parked in the grass and the property was used for assembly and overnight camping.

Fernandez obtained a special use permit application on June 30 but never filed it with the city, said Community Development Director Elizabeth Via.

In a letter dated Dec. 10, 2007, the city advised the owners not to use the property for these type of functions without first obtaining a permit. Fernandez had hosted several events on his property, including the fifth annual religious event Guadalupana in December.

A telephone message was left Monday for Fernandez, who has 30 days to appeal this violation. Failure to address this issue will “result in further legal action,” the letter states.

The city and the owners are already embroiled in a legal battle over the now infamous sign that sits at the corner of Liberty and Prince William streets. A court hearing is set for Sept. 5 to resolve building and zoning violations issued by the city.

The first violation resulted because the owners failed to apply for a permit after re-enforcing their partially demolished structure, a violation of the city building code. The owners re-enforced the structure in order to hang a more permanent political sign than the previous incarnations that were in place starting last September.

The house, which was badly damaged by fire in 2006, was partially demolished by the owners before they decided to use the remaining wall as a way to criticize Prince William County’s resolution targeting illegal immigrants and the city’s participation in the Immigration & Customs Enforcement 287 (g) program.
The zoning citation, the city contends, resulted from excessive litter and trash on the premises, which is against city code.

According to city manager Lawrence Hughes, the city will be seeking a judge’s order to correct the violations.

http://www.insidenova.com/isn/news/local/article/second_violation_issued_to_liberty_street_owners/18395/

The MJM reported this morning that Mr. Fernandez has received yet another citation for zoning violations. How many citations does it take for Mr. Fernandez to see his sign is a violation and the City is not going to go away? This sign, regardless of his message or your support or non-support is a blight on the neighborhood and in clear violation of the zoning norms that everyone else has to follow. He’s made his point, now it needs to go. He’s past the point of making a statement.

They’re making a feature length movie about the mini-revolution in Prince William County. You can see the trailer here. Corey Stewart is in the movie as himself. You will see him at frame 0:23.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ksnwIUyspps

Ah Alamo….. public trust is all legal citizens. I am one.

Most of Manassas agrees with Lucky Duck, including the MJM. Time to move on. Point taken.

SA, I don’t know why you would say

My God, you folks actually support this guys actions! Talk about far left (and South). I only wish that there were more billboards, only from the other point of view, so that this whole holier than thou issue of ‘free speech’ versus common sense would come to a conclusion.

you folks??? Other than uk visa, I have seen no one supporting the sign. Put that broad brush down! Shudder.

Mr. Fernandez isn’t going to court over his speech. He is going over zoning violations. His speech, regardless of how offensive to most of us, is protected supposedly. Or at least protected enough that the city isn’t going to bring up its content.

On the other hand, he gets another zoning violations for having tents on his property and a cook out? Seriously! What is the difference in what he did and a family reunion or graduation party? Should a friend of mine cancel her daughter’s swim party? I am not sure that isn’t just picking. Cars on the grass? Bet that isn’t the only spot that is happening.

Elena – Corey purposeful misleading is the point of many of these posts. The digression is simply a result of the absolute frustration of dealing with the man. He doesn’t care, he doesn’t listen so what should we talk about?

Back on track.

I would venture that public trust goes even beyond legal citizens. I would say it includes all visitors also. Why is SA even questioning who ‘the public is?’

Mr. Stewart seems to be making some bold statements that he cannot back up with facts. It is like he is pulling numbers out of…a hat. As for deportations? Can he verify that all 800 plus illegal immigrants picked up by ICE were deported? Probably not. Only a federal judge can issue a deportation order. Not all deportation orders include a free trip home.

I’m too irritated with Corey to make a meaningful statement about him and his claims. I bet you didn’t notice.

As for the sign and the functions Mr. F. has on his property, I think they are useful to a point but they are very much in the wrong place which is infuriating people. He actually got the application for special use. Why doesn’t he do anything with them?

I find it odd that the Corey supporters really have nothing more to say on this thread. Is his behavior just indefensible?

I’m sure the CoreyNGreg Show could like it nothing more than having this blog or any other forum discuss the immigration issue using Mr. Fernandez as Corey’s antipode. There is nothing special about Mr. Fernandez, other than the fact that Gospel Greg has, to varying degrees of success, shown that hate can be generated toward a defiant Mexican American more easily than most other Americans.

Mr. Fernandez is a legal citizen who disapproves of the Anti-Immigrant Lobby’s hostile take over our local government. I’m in the same camp, as are the majority of PWC citizens, regardless of ethnicity. That is the only qualification necessary to have an informed discussion about Corey Stewart’s deliberate fabrications and their impact on this community.

Stewart feels he has no choice but to “spin” lies and misinformation nationally because (a) that’s the only useful role the Anti-Immigrant Lobby has for him, (b) he is known for only one initiative, and it’s one that has failed so miserably that it was effectively revoked inside of a year. (c) Help Save Manassas is his only remaining political base, if he lost them, he’d be dead.

The impact on the community will be hard to measure, but my view is that as long as Corey’s spin is not challenged by his at least one of his Republican colleagues, Prince William County’s reputation will continue to suffer as a place where backward-thinking citizens allowed the Anti-Immigrant Lobby to take their government away from them. Investors, new businesses, and new residents will be taking this into consideration more than the actual letter of our infamous Immigration law. That’s why Stewart’s mouth is one of the biggest problems this county faces right now.

Moon-howler, the reason why Corey supporters have nothing to say is that the news story had a built-in “out” for them. They can attack Mr. Fernandez instead. Mr. Fernandez, like Corey, is a brave man who doesn’t back down from a fight. But otherwise, I don’t think there is much value in comparing the two. Mr. Fernandez’s sign embarrasses the city and the county in ways that are easily containable. Mr. Stewart’s inept leadership and shameless lies embarrasses the county in ways that I’m not sure we CAN contain.

Isn’t there someone else to whom we might compare Corey Stewart? How about George W. Bush? There are a number of parallels to draw for the purposes of a discussion. Here are some:

1) Both Bush and Stewart’s public statements are a continual embarrassment to the people they represent

2) Both Bush and Stewart’s failed leadership has been a disaster for the people they represent, and, a devastating blow to the reputation of the nation/county they represent.

3) Both Bush and Stewart were lured into a disastrous policy by cynical partisans using designed hysteria and stoked hatred to manipulate public opinion. Both learned to use the same tactics to as part of political campaigns, believing that hate and fear were an effective way to stay popular. Both learned differently.

“hate can be generated toward a defiant Mexican American more easily than most other Americans.”

Yeah, did you read those comments in the MJM/PN online? What a crew.

“Isn’t there someone else to whom we might compare Corey Stewart?”

Yes, but NO ONE would appreciate whom I would choose.

At a certain point, even the most devoted Hate Bunny learns that hate is an emotion that requires great investment and offers nothing in return.

Give them time.

WHWN,

I too would like to see some of Corey’s republican colleagues step up to the plate and say something….ANYTHING…to show that they are not part of the hysteria and the disinformation. 20% crime reduction in crime rate? Do the other BOCS members believe this bull? Can’t they rein him in? Do they fear him? Do they not realize the emporer has no clothes?

And let’s not overlook his claim that over 800 people have already been deported! Where is that proof?! Yes, more than 800 may have been turned over to ICE, but let’s see how many actual deportations there have been! No way is it even 1/10th of his claim. And the killer is that he presents himself as providing “facts”. What a disgusting liar.

Perhaps an open letter to the BOCS….asking why they are not trying to refute these lies?

Twinad, I believe Corey says WE have deported, doesn’t he? Does he even know that it takes a federal judge to order a deportation? WE, meaning PWC, cannot deport anyone. WE can only call for ICE. He is one big DIS-INFO-mercial. No one calls him on it.

I did an online search to see if I could find out how many people were deported in 2007. The latest number I could find was for 2005 and 200,000 people were deported in 2005. And our esteemed leader would have everyone believe that close to 900 were deported FROM PRINCE WILLIAM COUNTY ALONE in the last year!? Right. Back it up, Corey, or back down.

200,000 was for the whole year, right?

Oh yeah. I see that, Twin. Sorry.

I am perplexed by the moderate Republicans on the Board as well, Moon-Howler.

It’s quite possible that they were getting pressure from the state party not to acknowledge the “Emperor has no clothes” as you put it. In other words, there are some wishful thinkers in the party who still see Corey Stewart as a rising star. This could even be true, in fact, if the level of deception that exists in PWC could some how be exported to the rest of the state and the rest of the country.

As it becomes clear that Stewart is not fooling anyone in PWC, I think the state party bigwigs will give up on Stewart as a new-blood savior. You see, Stewart may be young (late 30’s), but his style is very much from the old school: governing well and sound policy matter not if you can propagandize enough people to stay in power. It’s just a bad strategy that has proven disastrous for both the nation and the national party.

But old habits die hard.

As it becomes clear the Presidential election will not be about Anti-Immigrant hysteria (despite the wishes of John Stirrup and Corey Stewart), the other four members of the BOCS who’s loyalty is to Prince William County first and foremost should have no conflicting pressures.

The problem is that the moderate Republicans on the Board are not willing to endure another round of GregNCorey Show political warfare. I don’t blame them honestly. The safe bet would be to wait it out. Let the media slowly sniff out the lies Corey is telling, and watch as his power-base dwindles. There also remains the possibility that Help Save Manassas and Gospel Greg will turn on Corey. This, if Corey decides to cut them loose in order to save his flailing career. If this happens, the GregNCorey Show political warfare spectacle would not need to include any of the moderate Republicans. It would be a war between the extreme right (Stewart) and the ultra-radical extreme right (Gospel Greg and HSM).

My only problem with the Supervisors taking the wait-and-hope approach is that the county is suffering in the mean time. They assume that with the two Democrats on the Board, they can overrule the two extremists (or govern without them if they continue to exhibit the boredom and disinterest they have shown of late). But there is a reason why we have a Chairman of the BOCS. The Chairman is supposed to lead. Our government would be many times more effective if we had a Chairman that was helping the county instead of hurting it.

The moderates on the Board would be taking a small risk politically, in order to gain big dividends for the county as a whole if they were to stand up to Chairman Stewart. If they were to do it as a team, the risk would be minimized, and the benefits to the county would be great. Let’s hope they are biding their time for one of the two scenarios I mentioned above.

We need to get out to the next Board meeting, Tuesday, July 22nd, and hold Corey Stewart accountable for his lies. Who will join me?

Anonfornow,

I would love to, but I am on vacation next week and am greatly looking forward to it.

I do hope some people turn out to hold him accountable, though.

Moonhowler,
I sent some of the Supervisors an email this morning and I’m awaiting a response.

Alanna,
Could you post your email to the supervisors? I’d like to send one as well.

Deportation whether self imposed or assisted by authorities is making your county a better and safer place to live.

Within the next two years if current trends continue you will be lucky enough to have exported the vast majority of your illegals into other jurisdictions. Those legal immigrants who stay because they have nothing to fear and no reason to flee will also be able to enjoy an overall improved quality of life along with the rest of you.

You guys need to get your check up from the neck up and shut up. It’s working don’t screw it up now.

Some T-shirt and bumper sticker ideas:
Stop the lies about my county, Mr. Stewart!
Get away from the cameras and do some work, Corey!
Shut the f*@k up, Corey! (courtesy of a brilliant friend)
Corey Stewart, I’m so sick of yo ass. (courtesy of another brilliant friend)
Corey Stewart is a big fat liar. (I read that on this blog at some point.)
Corey Stewart, step down.
Corey Stewart, why don’t you run for higher office and get the f*@k out of my county?
Corey Stewart, you do not represent me.
Corey Stewart, go back to where you came from!
Deport Corey Stewart and Greg Letiecq!

g.stone,

Hi, Corey!

Welcome to the blog!

“Corey Stewart, making Fairfax County a better place to live”

“For Sale…Corey Stewart’s Loyalty…best price before best interest”

“Corey Stewart 4 Mayor——Jackson Mississippi 2009″

WHWN,

I suppose I sympathize with the other Republicans. Who on earth would want to subject themselves to the lies told about people on the dark screen? It is easier to just keep your mouth shut. I almost feel like apologizing for my question.

G.stone, why don’t you let us (the residents of PWC) be the judge of what makes our county safer or better.

I guess I’ll fire off a few emails tomorrow.

G.man isn’t Corey. We know where Corey was when G.man logged on.

On the other hand, I do not particularly like the tone of his message–just something sinister. I also hate the expression ‘illegals.’ Illegal is an adjective, not a noun. An illegal WHAT?

Moonhowler,

I know, I just couldn’t resist!

Rod ought to apologize to all the former WorldCom employees he just offended. Just shows what a mean group of people hang out on this blog.

O-person…we will gladly let you correct the spelling of your name.

I must have missed a post about WorldCom employees.

Ok, we are mean. Next question??? What’s your point?

I was referencing Rod’s comment about Corey Stewart running for Mayor of Jackson, MS. He must have known what he was saying when he made that comment, obviously an insult intended for WorldCom. As a former WorldCom employee, that was a fairly mean comment. Many WorldCom employees, including me, lost a lot of retirement money thanks to Bernie Ebbers. Comparing Corey Stewart to Bernie Ebbers is pretty ridiculous actually. Bernie Ebbers is a felon, and deserves to be in jail.

I doubt it is worth my time to correct the spelling of my userid. Rod’s comment was a new low for this blog. There happens to be a lot of former WorldCom employees here in the Northern Virginia area.

O-person. Thanks for the explanation. I still don’t get the connection between Bernie Ebbers and Jackson, MS. Knowing Rod, I think if he meant to insult you it would not be so obscure.

Next time you post, just spell it correctly. You might not post immediately but someone will be around to approve you.

An oberserver — just give Corey time. He will catch up and could probably exceed Bernie Ebbers with a worse moral compass… Not mitigating your problem. But he has several thousand employees as well. He is on a destructive path that could ruin their lives as much as yours as been ruined.

why the picture of the illegal alien day laborer? I dont understand. is that KG’s boyfriend or something?

Juturna – you evidently don’t know Bernie Ebbers then. To compare Corey Stewart to Bernie Ebbers is beyond ridiculous.

Moon-howler – OK, I see the correct spelling of my userid works. Thanks. I did not mean to imply Rod insulted me directly, but he did basically insult a whole pile of WorldCom employees with his reference to Corey Stewart running for Mayor of Jackson, MS. Anyone who worked for WorldCom would not think of comparing Bernie Ebbers to Corey Stewart, whether they were for or against Corey Stewart. Then again, his post followed a bunch of other basically insulting posts – so I guess in that respect he should be forgiven – he was just continuing what others, including kghotthardt, started with a bunch of silly insults and attacks.

G. Stone and Elvis,

You just inspired me to donate money to national council of la raza. Thanks guys

Has anyone tried Zumba? If so, is it a good workout? I’m thinking of taking my first class tonight.

Observer, I think he was referencing Jackson, MS’s rather blighted racial history. I don’t associate WorldCom and Bernie Ebbers. I don’t think most people do. Rob may correct me if I am wrong.

You can lose a great deal of money just sitting on your sofa these days. I am been doing it very well, I am sorry to say.

Moon-howler – OK, if he was than that’s a different story, in which case I take back what I said.

Observer, I think he was referencing Jackson, MS’s rather blighted racial history. I don’t associate WorldCom and Bernie Ebbers. I don’t think most people do. Rob may correct me if I am wrong.

You can lose a great deal of money just sitting on your sofa these days. I am been doing it very well, I am sorry to say.

==================================================

Moon Howler got it right, I don’t even know what the F&*% worldcom is, but from the way you lit off on me, you need to sort out your issues with them Observer. You can yell at me for implying Corey Stewart is connected to Mississippi’s sorted past…but I don’t have a clue about what worldcom is, or I guess was. I’ll do some research later, your passionate defense has sparked my curiosity….

Actually this WorldCom thing is connected to us locally…

“On July 21, 2002, WorldCom filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy protection in the largest such filing in United States history. WorldCom changed its name to MCI, and moved the corporate headquarters from Clinton, Mississippi to Dulles, Virginia, on April 14, 2003.

Under the bankruptcy reorganization agreement, the company paid $750 million to the SEC in cash and stock in the new MCI, which was intended to be paid to wronged investors.

In May 2003, the company was given a no-bid contract by the United States Department of Defense to build a cellular telephone network in Iraq. The deal has been criticized by competitors and others who cite the company’s lack of experience in the area.”

from; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MCI_Inc.

Now what I don’t get Observer is that it was originally based in Clinton Mississippi, now I’m not sure how close that is to Jackson, but if I was going to make a crack about Bernie Ebbers being like Corey Stewart, I would have clearly referenced Clinton. Your protest have also exposed that the leftovers of the WorldCom problems are right next door to PWC now. Your protest against comparisons of Corey and Worldcom now seem frantic, suspicious…I’ll have to investigate more, thanks for the lead observer.

Wikipedia is frequently wrong – WorldCom’s headquarters were for many years in Jackson, Mississipi which is where the company was founded and run by Ebbers, who is now in jail.

Anyway, I didn’t mean to turn this thread into a WorldCom thread, so let’s drop the subject since that wasn’t what you were referring to. For me, Jackson, MS associates itself in my mind with WorldCom – I didn’t realize you were referring to a less recent time in Jackson history.

There is however nothing “frantic, suspicious” about my protest against what I thought was a comparison of Corey Stewart to a felon who is now in jail for basically robbing employees and investors of hundreds of millions of dollars.

Anyway, again let’s drop it as it was my mistake thinking you were referring to WorldCom.

El Jeffe Fernandez has a way with words, doesn’t he? He’s a legal immigrant (good for him) since 1979. Maybe in another 20+ years he’ll be able to express himself in English!

Sorry to disappoint Elvis, but I’m happily married. Excluding my husband, my interest in men is purely agape.

Corey Stewart is connected with Satan.

Is that better?

So HE was the one in the devil suit at the Christmas parade! Now it all makes sense…

I just don’t get it. How can ANY of you advocate that we should not REMOVE illegal aliens WHO HAVE COMMITTED CRIMES from our neighborhoods? What you are advocating for is that we KEEP them because they belong to a racial, gender, religious, ethnic group you want supported and priviliged even if it means keeping criminals on our streets. What kind of lunacy advocacy is that, when you SUPPORT CRIME?

Also if we have DEPORTED 800 some illegal criminal aliens, how can you not see that is a 20% or GREATER drop in crimes they have commited (which show up in crime statistics of the past), and would commit again, and again, and again as soon as we let them lose on our neighborhoods again, but are not now here to commit them. Any dummy can see the math in that. What percentage of all arrested criminals in PWC is 800 people subject to deportation? I’ll bet its close to 20%.

Are ethnic group sympathies so high you would favor crime over deporting ANYONE who is a member of a racial, gender, religious, ethnic group you want to keep in the country at all costs?

This is why I fight people who think like this, it is crazy thinking. Corey is simply enforcing the LAW, and removing CRIMINALS from our neighborhoods as the citizens ASKED him to.

Put your heads back on your shoulders please. We are talking about removing crime here, do you really advocate you want even more crime than we have? If you do then you really have “lost” it, as many of us already suspect.

“So HE was the one in the devil suit at the Christmas parade! Now it all makes sense…” Heee hee heee! Emma

“How can ANY of you advocate that we should not REMOVE illegal aliens WHO HAVE COMMITTED CRIMES from our neighborhoods? ”

HUH? Where are you getting that ANYONE advocates this, Michael?

What exactly have illegal immigrants done for our community? There’s a long list of problems they cause. That’s why the nation refers to it as the ‘Illegal immigrant PROBLEM’. It wouldn’t be referred to as a PROBLEM if the end result was positive!

This sign is simply a bunch of “anti-White” hate group crap. The owner is ANGRY that we are deporting CRIMINALS from our neighborhoods, and he thinks these criminals (largely members of his own ethnic group) should be allowed to stay. If not we are “racists”. We are following the LAW, he is not, he has broken many. Idiots, complete idiots.

KG, why are you fighting 287g and blasting Corey for enforcing the law? If you weren’t fighting that and Corey for supporting the law and 287g, which removes criminal aliens, I might believe you are not advocating against law enforcement.

You know, if you hate Corey that much, then just vote for someone else next time. This is a democracy, and the majority elected him, so deal with it. All the whining in the world isn’t going to help. Besides, I thought this blog wanted to find solutions, but then I guess the existing one is working quite well!

Michael, I don’t get why you cannot read. No one is criticizing the 287g program. Listen very carefully: We are saying that Corey Stewart has not presented facts that back up what he is saying. We are looking at PWCPD statistics. They do not bear out what Corey is saying. He is establishing a cause/effect relationship where one does not necessarily exist. He is self aggrandizing. We want him to speak the truth.

SA, I guess that you could say the same thing about the Republican candidate, John McCain. All I have seen is a bunch of whining about the candidate. Get over it. Don’t vote for him. Now I am not saying this about you, but I sure have read a lot of nay-saying over on the black screen.

I certainly will hold a candidate responsible. I don’t hate Corey. I find his duplicitousness contemptible. What you are suggesting is politically irresponsible. That is how many unscrupulous individuals have remained in power–when good people did nothing. I want Corey to tell the truth. I want him to be his own person and stop having a handler.

“KG, why are you fighting 287g and blasting Corey for enforcing the law?”

I’m not.

“I find his duplicitousness contemptible.”

Ditto.

“You know, if you hate Corey that much, then just vote for someone else next time.”

Didn’t vote for his THIS time.

Don’t care what his politics are if they work FOR our county, not AGAINST it. CS/JS care not about the county. They care about their political selves, their personal bias and a clique of anti-immigrant groups that foster bigotry that they support through their speech, actions, and decisions.

Corey Stewart LIES and he uses MY tax dollars for HIS agenda.

THAT is why I find him contemptible.

Segundo Alamo:

You know, if you hate Corey that much, then just vote for someone else next time. This is a democracy, and the majority elected him, so deal with it. All the whining in the world isn’t going to help. Besides, I thought this blog wanted to find solutions, but then I guess the existing one is working quite well!

One should never stop applying pressure to one’s elected officials in between elections. You should always let them know if you are upset with them and if you can organize a whole group of people to coordinate the application of pressure through free speech, petitions, media, etc. its 100 time more effective.

Oh, and another thing Segundo Alamo. This is NOT a Democracy. This is a Republic.

It is pointless to remember the Alamo if you do not even know what type of government you have. Read the Constitution.

And I would be DUCKING for cover when Lucky Duck shows up, sees your response and replies. DUCK is definitely the operative word of the day here.

Hi Elena, I did see his post and I replied to it. I still had the same question for him as he didn’t answer what I asked him.

Let Gospel Greg bang his head against the wall that is Chief Charlie Deane. It only serves to remind us what a deranged sociopath he is, and how little he knows about this county and the people who live here. Corey Stewart should get a new best friend.

From BVBL –
“elvis said on 13 Jul 2008 at 5:25 pm:
even the fat broads wouldnt cook up something so stupid. They ARE stupid but at least semi-literate. OK, I’ll concede they have at least a 8th grade education which is far more than the fool who wrote that letter.”

It would be AN 8th grade education, not A 8th grade education.

Here’s the rule:
“A” goes before all words that begin with consonants with one exception, words that begin with an unsounded “H”, as in, “an honorable person.”

“An” goes before all words that begin with vowels(a, e, i, o, u) like “an idiot” with two exceptions: when “U” makes the same sound as the y in you, or “O” makes the same sound as w in won, then a is used.

A good Jesuit education teaches you these things.

Great post on the other thread, Lucky Duck. I agree with Elena! I learned something tonight I didn’t already know, so thank you. I don’t know if you have already posted this over the last few weeks or if you can’t answer, but I wonder how you have such a good grasp on what the law actually entails? Are you a member of or do you know someone on the police force or are you an attorney? Completely understand if you can’t or won’t answer, but I’m just wondering. It would be good to know if there are people posting that are in that kind of position to really know what goes on.

Can you confirm that there is no way in hell that over 800 PWC residents have been deported in the last year?! And if they have not, can someone tell Corey?

Yeah, there was/is a lot of confusion in the public arena about what could be done, what was being done and what is currently being done. The other side had a year head start as a monoply in putting out their side.

While in immigration training the police were told that there was only a slight difference in actions in what they were doing pre resolution as opposed to post resolution. The immigrant community and the general public, in a lot of instances, are still in the dark or have serious misconceptions about what is being done and what is not.

Got a question–what statistics are you all talking about? The other subject area compared the first six months with the last six months of the same year. That is not valid either.

Compare the same time periods so that you are not comparing two different seasons. I wouldn’t be surprised if crime always goes up when school is out, it is hot and people are out from their homes more. But stop saying something is “fact”. It may very well show an increase in crime over the same period of the previous year but nothing I have seen on here supports that. I will be glad to look at the statistics done the proper way. I tried to figure out where those figures came from and someone said that someone got them from the police department–but it was never noted that way.

Try for real stats and I will agree with you. By the way, everyone has complained about Corey Stewart talking about a Manassas sign–well, the sign says “PWC” on it as well. Try to grow up a bit, and maybe I will start to agree with some of your venomous discussions.

Alanna,

Ha ha! I thought Elvis claimed to be an attorney a few month’s ago. The language in his posts (and not just the one you cited above) is certainly not indicative of a good law school education. I pity the poor souls (if there are any) that put their future in his hands as their lawyer.

Michael, you have been reading too much Gospel Greg. That is the cause of your confusion. Chief Deane is not your enemy.

And gee, taking someone to task because they said democracy versus republic? Pretty lame.

But Elena, it is important because the message that is skewed is not a message at all whether on this board or Corey Stewart or BVBL. The only official report I have seen deals with 2007 from the police department and it does show a 20% decline over the previous year. Does it have to do with the resolution? Beats me because no one has done a study to see.

BTW, I really dislike it when people use terms like “spew”. I try to stay away from inflamatory remarks, for which there is no excuse, if someone is trying to frame an argument. It is what I have objected to on here but people don’t seem to look into their own mirrors when they say, “Gospel Greg”, whom I have never met, or any other endearing term some posters want to use. I just tune out the author if they can’t address the issue.

And I have seen way to much pettiness on here. And I have taken the other board to task as well. I find both boards humorous in their own little hypocracy (and please someone, point out my spelling on here rather than deal with my arguments.) It adds to my humor.

Elena said: “Go back to the thread and look under the first graph “According to the 2007 Crime Statistic Report” that links you to the report”

I read the report and if you will tell me what page it divided things by month I will look closer but I saw nothing.

Twinad, KGotthardt keeps guessing so you may want to ask her.

You’re looking for an answer for the claim of nearly 800 people being deported and if its accurate or not. That could have been the number the jail has turned over to ICE. I don’t know the exact number ( I do know it has been several hundred) and do not want to present non-factual information. Only ICE can give you the number actually deported.

Once the people are turned over by the jail to ICE, they are no longer under the jurisdiction of the agency that incarcerated them. Some of those picked up are already under deportation orders and would be quickly flown to their Country of orgin. The other people will be detained by ICE in their holding facilities as the starting point in the immigration system. Still others will be released with a pending immigration court date.

A PW County Resident:

And gee, taking someone to task because they said democracy versus republic? Pretty lame.

What’s lame is not knowing the difference and especially not knowing that our system of government is a republic. The difference is huge. A true patriot would never confuse the two.

Isn’t there something abhorrent about saying you advocate the removal of working class immigrants for the good of the country when you don’t even know what kind of government your country uses?

Lucky Duck,

Thanks for the information. I agree, I believe + or – 800 people have been turned over to ICE, but there is no way Corey can be truthful in saying that many have been deported.

ICE doesn’t immediately deport the vast majority of people they detain in raids and they only hold most of them for a day or a few days at the most unless they are identified as criminals. If they aren’t deporting the people they are detaining themselves, I can’t imagine they are deporting all of PWC resident’s turned over to them for driving without a license or for a traffic stop infraction.

The only quick deportations, according to ICE, are those individuals that are already under a deportation order and have not shown up and are caught and those that have been deported once before and are caught again.

While you are correct in stating that ICE does not immediately deport the others brought into custody, it does start the process for those individuals. It may take a while, but they are in the process and its very, very difficult for them to beat ICE. The immigration court system is not like our criminal court system. The onus is on the defendant to overturn the government’s evidence, as opposed to our criminal court system in which the government must prove the case. I would not want to be in an immigration court trying to overturn the government’s case. Those victories are few and far between.

So Mackie, a true Patriot would NEVER support Illegal Immigration. I served my country honorably, how about you? My comment referred to the democratic process of electing officials by majority vote of those governed, but then pick away if it makes you feel more Patriotic. My reference to ‘dealing with it’ is that you can whine all you want, but apparently there are a lot more (majority) that support Corey’s actions, hence his election. This is one Patriot that supports law enforcement, as opposed to anarchists who are constantly trying to oppose it.

TWINAD,

I may be wrong, but I thought there were 700 to 800 people already held in jail for crimes that were being processed for deportation. Those people are, as you state “unless they are identified as criminals” are criminals and therefore would be deported, and not released. So, I think Corey is correct.

Stewart spews ’statistics’ that he wants to represent his point of view. He has not backed up these figures. He has attempted to establish cause/effect relationships where none exist.

Corey just need to be truthful. That is all we ask. Crime has not decreased by 20% since the Resolution was passed, any of the 3 times. If he has statistics to show this, where are they? How come he would have numbers different from PWCPD? Seems strange to me.

I feel certain that PWC has not deported over 800 ‘illegals’ because only a federal judge can order a deportation. Corey would be correct if he said that the ADC turned over 800 illegal immigrants to ICE. We do not know if they were deported or not. The spin is just amazing.

Finally, Corey needs to leave THE sign comments to the City of Manassas officials, rather than whining that ‘it isn’t fair.’ How embarrassing. Talk about sending mixed messages.

SA,

They may have been held in PWC jail and turned over to ICE, but in no way does that mean they have already been deported, which is the statement Corey made. ICE only holds “the worst of the worst” or they deport the people that have already been deported once or have a deportation order in place already. If he can show evidence that over 800 people have ALREADY been deported, as he states, then okay. But I don’t think he can and I don’t think anyone else does either. He messed up his statement on TV…but do you think he will correct himself? I don’t. Not unless someone forces him to.

Lucky Duck,

Agreed on your post regarding the difficulty in avoiding eventual deportation or voluntary deportation. But it appears to me that ICE is deliberately dragging their feet on all cases where the people are not “real” criminals until comprehensive immigration law changes are made that would allow many of these people to stay…not people arrested for DUI, rape, etc. But people caught in work raids, or traffic stops,etc. I mean, I know some people detained in one of the raids and their ICE case worker says it will be years before their case is decided.

If all the county can do is turn people over to ICE for future deportation, then the county has done the most it can, so therefore it is accomplishing the only goal obtainable. The technical issue of what truly happens to these people under ICE authority is out of Corey’s control, and so that is the most he can take credit for. Technically his statement was flawed, but the intent to show that the Resolution is doing all it can do was correct.

SA,

He needs to be truthful. He needs to say that the county has done its part. What he doesn’t need to do is say that the deportation of over 800 has happened because of the resolution and that the county has deported them. The resolution has nothing to do with the 800 plus illegal aliens being turned over to ICE. The county can deport no one.

When we start dealing with facts rather than spin, perhaps we can start cleaning up the mess this county has made of this issue.

Yes, illegal immigration has impacted our area. No one denies that. Many of us would have preferred to take that wasted 4 million dollars and infused it into agencies like Neighborhood Services, where the money could do some good. More importantly, we would have control over our money. Instead, we really have a resolution that does nothing other than eat money. We have a damaged national reputation and resident has been pitted against resident. Corey needs to learn the issues and to speak to them honestly.

Very interesting article today in a NJ paper about a man who created and led a “Rule of Law” anti-immigration group — and why he’s now left that group, and changed his mind:

http://dailyrecord.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080716/COMMUNITIES34/807160442&referrer=FRONTPAGECAROUSEL

Very interesting indeed. Thanks for sharing this article Casual Observer.

Thanks, MH! I also found the readers’ comments eerily familiar! I think FAIR may have its sites set further on up 95, but the township/borough decentralized form of government in NJ will make it difficult –and expensive –for them to get any kind of momentum. They’d have to have resolutions proposed and enacted in every locality, which is why the Riverside, NJ laws failed so miserably.

I think the problem with comparing numbers is about understanding their significance. The difference between crime percentages doesn’t mean that statistically you can defend it. It could have been caused by chance.
Where do I find the raw data to run some analyses?
By tha way, Elvis is not a lawyer, he is a rocket surgeon.

Casual – that is a great story. Glad to see a thread about it. It’s a bittersweet story though. Why do we inflict so much pain on ourselves and others rather than try to think a little differently?
Thank you for posting it.

TH – Go to DOJ and search UCR (Uniform Crime Reporting). UCR methodology takes the more serious of the crime and reports only that therefore in the case of a carjacking, where one victim is assualted and one killed only the homicide is reported.

The Virginia State Police now use a different methodology based on the number of incidents – in the case above they report all three.

I explain that incase you do a comparison of the two VSP will look much higher than DOJ.

Both websites have the data I think you are looking for.

Twinad, I know it takes years for an immigration case to get through the system, but people I know who work for ICE would strongly dispute your comment that ICE is “deliberately dragging their feet” on any deportation proceedings. While it is true that higher profile illegal alien criminals may draw more attention and are a higher priority for the immigration system (that would slow others down), there are court dates set for everyone in the deportation process and there are a very limited amount of immigration courts. In addition, there are numerous appeals for each individual to use if they so desire. So perhaps your friend’s attorney meant that it would be or could be years for a final outcome, which is more than likely true, as opposed to a first court appearance or ICE interaction.

I am sure they are doing their best with the funding resources provided them. Like the rest of us, they are a bit short or DHS is not very strategic when it comes to funding.

Lucky Duck,

Yes, you are right…I haven’t checked my wording above, but I did mean years before the final outcome, not the first court date. And it wasn’t the attorney that said this, it was the ICE case worker assigned to monitor the guy making his way through the system.

LD,
What I find odd, are cases where ICE goes into the raids with helicopters and all the show of a spectacular event but then immediately release them with the majority of the rest being released within a few weeks. It seems a bit theaterical.

It does cause me to question whether or not those 750 persons who have been handed over to ICE have actually been deported, or just detained, or conceivably released.

Hi Alanna, I agree that part of those raids are for show, to the public at large, government funding sources and employers.

But the part that everyone forgets is that such an action introduces dozens or hundreds of people into the immigration system with a final outcome of either deportation or some type of adjusted status (at least in the past). So while some are released, they are not forgotten by ICE. To me, that may be worse than knowing my fate immediately. Its like waiting for the gallows to be built. I know you have stated that you have known people in such a legal limbo. I have met them too and some are resigned to their fate of deportation but want to stay as long as they can. That’s no way to live.

Even if everyone of those 750/800 (?) people have been released (law of averages would dictate some are still in custody today), they are on the path to deportation or, an unlikely event that will adjust their status. But that are starting down the slipperly slope.

Bold face lies by politicians rarely affect a politician. The Bush administration’s false claims that the outrageous Medicare drug handout would only cost $400 billion probably didn’t cost a single vote in 2004. Corey Stewart will hardly face any criticism from his supporters for the outrageous lies he’s been spreading despite the clear evidence to the contrary.